For those of you who don’t read the weekend posts, I was so happy yesterday to wake up to the strong smell of cigarettes Saturday after pining away like a mama martyr the days before over the lack of recent Erik visits. It made me so happy. I have a feeling a lot of you got on his ass! Haha.
Don’t forget about Erik’s Hour of Enlightenment radio show tomorrow at 5:00 PM PT/7:00 PM CT/8:00 PM ET. The topic will be ANXIETY, and energy healer, Ryan Adragna, will join in with Erik. No more than 15 minutes before the top of the hour, call 619-639-4606 to ask Erik your question. If you are an international caller, you can call in using Skype. There are three ways to listen: Listen on the phone line, click on the “Listen” icon on the right sidebar of the blog or click on this link: http://goo.gl/aFHTzJ
Enjoy the last segment of our interview with L. Ron Hubbard. Again, thanks, Joyce M., for transcribing it for us! It’s quite a chore, I know! As always, the YouTube version follows.
Elisa: One more thing about David Miscavige, the current leader. Has he turned Scientology into a destructive force? I mean, how do you feel about the way he’s handling things?
LRH: Again, he’s just taking everything like I did. He’s taking it to the nth degree. Is he destructive? In many ways absolutely positively. He’s destructive.
Elisa: Are you okay with how he’s handling the Church of Scientology?
LRH: Right now? From right here? Absolutely positively. Yes, it’s all planned. I have no problems.
Elisa: Because you’re trying to teach people to find their own voice. I understand that.
LRH: Absolutely. He’s squeezing them a little harder than I did, do you see?
LRH: Though he’s pushing them even harder. What is their breaking point to find their own voice? To find their own thought patterns? To find their own opinions?
Elisa: Okay. All right, here’s one from somebody. “Surely he has regrets of the outcome of what he created..” I don’t think so “what is the fastest way to bring it down and restore these peoples lives?”
LRH: Well you know, you could seriously damage people to bring something of this magnitude down so fast, and send them into all kinds of deep despair.
LRH: To bring it down, because don’t forget, all these people are emotionally dependent on us, on someone else. Right, to bring it down? Well each person’s got to do that for themselves.
Elisa: Okay, that makes sense. At what age did you know you wanted to be a writer?
LRH: Oh my gosh, I would say as young as 11 I was writing. I wanted to do that. I loved it. I was on fire. It lit me up.
Elisa: How long did you write Science Fiction before you started transitioning your writing into what you now call a religion?
LRH: I will say that it evolved from Science Fiction to religion.
Celestine: I just thought of a comment in my head of how religion and science are now coming together.
Elisa: Ah, that’s true. That’s true.
Celestine: And he liked that point. He kind of smiled at me. He gave me the thumbs up. See, I can think for myself.
Elisa: There we go LRH! Celestine has it going on!
Celestine: (laughing) That’s right man.
LRH: It was about a process, an evolvement, of 25-30 years.
Elisa: Okay. Describe the situation surrounding your unfavorable discharge from the armed services. Is this where you came up with the idea for all of this?
Celestine: Well, he says that he made quite a few people very unhappy in the higher ranks of the military service.
Elisa: Why? How? What happened?
LRH: I was disrespectful. My ego was even big back then and..
Celestine: (to LRH) Could you be a little clearer? Because he just talks about having some kind of mishaps that led to the end of his career.
Elisa: In the military.
Celestine: Yes, in the military.
LRH: I’m going to answer this with my ego; I was done with it.
Elisa: Okay. Okay. You were done with the armed services.
LRH: I was done with it. Mm Hm.
Elisa: Okay. (reading) “How long were you traveling around” I didn’t know this “mooching off people before you were able to start this religion, and how much money did you borrow and bilk people out of before the religion was formed?” So how long were you traveling around mooching off of people, and then how much money did you
Celestine: (laughing) He giggles when we use the word “mooch”, and he looks at me and he says “everybody was happy to let me couch surf for as long as I wanted.”
Elisa: (laughing) Oh couch surf, okay okay.
LRH: It was quite a while, but people really liked my stories. I’m rather charming and engaging.
Elisa: I bet.
Celestine: He’s giving me a time period of 5-7 years that it took him to build.
Celestine: And bilk, he takes issue with “bilk” people out of their money.
Celestine: Oh borrow.
Elisa: Donated? What?
Celestine: Donate, well he said “borrow, they were all donations”.
Celestine: In his mind. (laughing)
Elisa: And how much?
Celestine: Oh he says, he says there were hundreds of thousands of dollars.
Elisa: Wow. Okay, (reading) “how much of your teachings, direction and actions were due to the teachings and/or spending time with Aleister Crowley?” I didn’t know that.
LRH: Aleister and I were the best of friends and we pinged off one another, our personalities, and we would send the idea out, and the other would send a response back, and it was an incredible intellectual union of two people. And how much did I learn from him? Oh, so much.
Elisa: What do you think he thinks about you now?
LRH: He thinks I’m just fine.
Elisa: Did you pick David Miscavige to take over for the church?
Elisa: Okay. (reading) “What kind of activities took place on your ship in international waters that people don’t know about.” Ooh. We’re almost finished.
Celestine: He’s talking about all kinds of sexual activities that went on on the ship out there at night time, if that’s what they’re asking about, but there’s also rituals that they do for Scientology, and you know, they would start as rituals and sharing and people on boats and what he’s showing me, it’s almost like they were.. I feel high, I feel like I’m under an influence.
Elisa: Okay, why did you all smoke pot? Or coyote?
Celestine: No, it was something else. I don’t know what it is.
Elisa: So there were drugs involved.
Celestine: I feel like he put something in their drinks.
Elisa: Oh wow.
Celestine: On this boat. He’s saying yes, he did. So that softened them up, and they did ‘church rituals’ and then that led to the sexual activities.
Elisa: Sexual activities with minors? Or adults?
Celestine: He just said “yes”.
Elisa: Mm, so with minors.
Celestine: He just said “yes”
Elisa: Well tell me about your work now. Are you helping people? What are you doing in the afterlife? You’re probably not [unintelligible]
LRH: After teaching such a hard lesson to people, and you know, just about everybody hates me for who I was and what I did, from this side and this perspective, I really feel like I want to be with those that don’t feel like they have a voice or can make up their own mind. I believe they’re not.. and with the members of the Scientology family, I stand next to them. I don’t encourage them from this side to subscribe to anything. From here, I’m standing next to them, telling them “what do you think about that, but the other day something happened?”. I’m giving, and I’m leaving little seeds, with not only them, but with many many people. The Church of Scientology and the way that they control people’s minds is like a fingernail of the population who allow this to go on.
Elisa: So are you trying to encourage people, on this side, to think for themselves? Is that what you’re saying?
LRH: I absolutely am.
Elisa: Well that’s good. Tell me about your death experience, and who did you meet upon your arrival?
LRH: It was like waking up, again, from a very heavy sleep.
Elisa: Oh yeah, you said you went into nothingness.
LRH: and dreamed and when I stepped over, the three people that met me, well believe it or not, my mother, my father..
Celestine: (to LRH) are you kidding? Okay.
Celestine: Okay. I imagine…he looked at me and just said “somewhere in my background, in my teaching, that was something that had been ingrained and that made me feel good.
LRH: So that’s when I stepped over and.. Mom and Dad helped me get to the vibration, Jesus took me to the life review.
Elisa: How was your life review?
LRH: Looking back on it, you know everybody thinks you just review this part of your life, the one you had just passed, but for me it was different. I reviewed different lifetimes.
LRH: And different experiences that brought me to this lifetime, to help me process everything that I did.
LRH: To not judge, and to understand that it had a specific purpose in my life.
Elisa: Have you spent any time with Erik at all? (pause) Or not.
Celestine: Yep no, Erik comes up, he goes “Yeah Mom, we’ve been for a week now”.
Elisa: Okay. In preparation.
Celestine: In preparation. And he’s says “You know, I just want to clear up one thing about LRH Hubbard to everybody, because things are different on this side, and we have such a different perspective.
Elisa: Oh yeah.
Erik: I just want to give him kudos for forcing people to think for themselves.
Elisa: Absolutely. LRH, what do you think about my boy and what he’s doing?
LRH: He’s very favorable. I really like his personality.
Celestine: (giggling) They do a high five, and the funniest thing is you know Erik’s Erik in all his big personality.
Elisa: Oh yeah.
Celestine: and he’s walking around, and the hair’s going, and he’s got his hand up and LRH gives him a high five, but LRH is very reserved and he just puts his hand up like this (raises hand) and Erik bounces up and whoo! (slaps hand).
Elisa: (laughing) Aw, that’s funny.
Celestine: It is.
Elisa: Okay, how many children did you father?
Celestine: Oh my goodness. He says in the 30s.
Elisa: Wow. Man.
LRH: But women love the power.
Elisa: Of course. They’re drawn to that. How did you come to know how to physiologically take advantage of people with the tasks you asked them to complete in interviews, and the incorporation of the use of the E-meter? The thing they poke cans and tell whether you’re lying or not, whatever.
Celestine: He’s going to say that the E-meter was not an actual scientific invention, that he controlled them so much that they believed..
Celestine: That he could tell whether they were telling the lie just from holding it.
Celestine: And that wasn’t actually the truth. But I need the first part of the question.
Elisa: How did you come to know how to physiologically take advantage of people with that. I guess.
LRH: You know, that’s the easiest part of it all. Once you’ve conquered their mind, you can conquer anything.
Elisa: Physiology. Okay, that makes sense. I got just a few more questions. Were you here to learn anything?
Celestine: He’s thinking, right.
LRH: I learned to find myself. When I had no voice whatsoever I learned how to communicate to people and how to get people to pay attention to me.
Elisa: Awesome. Do you have any regrets? I think I asked that before, but I’m sorry if I did. but do you have any regrets?
Elisa: Okay. Do you have any messages for your membership? Your Scientology, you know, peeps?
LRH: From this side, yes.
Elisa: Tell me.
LRH: I want you to go back and review everything all in my teachings. I want you to go back and feel if this is right for you. If you can 100 percent say you get what you need, want out of what I have written, what I have taught, then you stick with it. If you have any doubts in your mind, even a little bit, you explore that doubt.
Elisa: Okay. Awesome. Is there anything you can share about you that nobody else knows about? It’s just a fun question.
Celestine: So yeah, he’s talking about, I don’t think any (to LRH) Really? Okay. He was obsessed with building things. From the time he was little, if he wasn’t writing he was building things. He says it carried all the way through his adulthood and it was an outlet for his energy. But like building little villages. Little diatribes I think is what you call it?
Elisa: Oh yeah, dioramas maybe?
Celestine: Dioramas! Yeah, that’s it. Dioramas
Elisa: So like, what was an example? What was the first thing you built as a child, and what did you build it from?
Celestine: Well the first thing he’s showing me is a dinosaur-scape, where he had little dinosaurs, which were plastic by the way, but he was pretty ingenious, and what he’s showing me is that you know, they left him to his own devices, but he had a lot of paper, he had a lot of access to supplies, and he would ball up colored paper, like green, and ball it up and then the dinosaurs would go over the mountains, and that was the very first of it.
Elisa: Okay, that’s cute.
Celestine: It is cute.
Elisa: Can you share another life that seemed to influence your life as L. Ron Hubbard?
Celestine: He’s taking me back to a lifetime. And he’s a female in this lifetime, and he can neither hear nor speak, but he can see. And he has every intellectual ability that he had in this lifetime, and it’s totally intact.
Elisa: Mm hm.
Celestine: But he can’t communicate, and it’s beyond frustrating. I feel like, rage, inside of me. Like I want to cry because I just want to get out what I want to get out. So now this makes a little more sense to me because he couldn’t speak, and now he’s telling me he’s sending all this, because he couldn’t speak in that lifetime, he wanted to tell people who could speak, and refuse to speak for themselves, and show them what it was like. To appreciate your ability to think and speak for yourself.
Elisa: Oh awesome. I could see that. So Celestine, Erik do you all have and final questions to ask L Ron Hubbard before we close?
Celestine: (to Erik) I’m not asking that question. Your son wants to know what it was like to have 30-some kids, and then I looked at him and I said “do you mean what it was like to have sex that many times Erik?”
Elisa: What did Erik say?
Celestine: Right? (laughing) And L. Ron Hubbard just puts up his thumb and goes “it was all right”.
Elisa: Oh my god! What about you Erik, do you have anything for him?
Celestine: That was Erik’s question, I can’t even believe it.
Elisa: Oh okay.
Celestine: Yeah, I can’t even believe it. But, they’ve been talking for a while.
Elisa: Okay, so Celestine do you have anything to share like your website, any information about you that you want people to know about?
Celestine: Lets see, my website is divinemessages.love, and I do private readings, and bear with me, I have a schedule that I have to follow but I love everybody, and I just want to tell Elisa and Erik thank you. I tell them this every time because I’m so grateful. Erik’s taught me everything, and has brought me here, and it’s through Elisa’s work that I’m sitting here with her wonderful son who I absolutely adore and love. And he loves each and every one of you as well.
Elisa: Well we’re grateful to see you too Celestine. I love you Erik. Guys I will put her information on the title page of this YouTube and you know, check her out. Check her out. She is awesome. Thank you. I love you Celestine, I love you Erik and thank you so much L. Ron Hubbard for taking the courage to step out and clarify some things for us.
Celestine: He says, “You’re very welcome.” Erik says “I love you Mamma!” (blows kisses)
Elisa: Bye, I love you.
Celestine: I love you Elisa and thank you,
Elisa: Thank you.
Celestine: We’ll talk soon.