This segment of the transcript starts out with more on DMT, which we’ve already covered to some degree. Sorry. But then Erik delves into a very important subject that I, for one, grapple with day in and day out. Enjoy.

Me: Erik, I read an article about the D.M.T. spirit molecule. It’s that natural substance we all have, and they’re trying to figure out what it is about that molecule that gives people spiritual epiphanies. I’ve heard that Jim Carrey and others go out and licks poisonous Amazonian frogs that secrete D.M.T. from their skin to have spiritual experiences. What’s that all about?

Jamie (laughing): Seriously, Jim Carrey does that?

Me: I know! Well, that’s what I’ve heard. Maybe he just did it once, but apparently there are people who do it regularly.

Erik: When you have D.M.T. abundance in the body or when it’s in a position where it comes to the surface to be used—that’s what makes us feel connected to God. That’s what makes us all knowing. The suppressing element we have is really our logic, which controls the hormone system in the body that dampens—

Me: Well, what does D.M.T. do? Does it sort of disconnect our spirit a little bit from the body or… I wonder how it works.

Erik: It kind of works more on a cellular level.

Jamie; He kind of rolls his eyes when you said that about the disconnecting the spirit from the body!

Me: Sorry!

Erik, Jamie and I laugh.

Erik: You know, it’s not really like there, but it’s a great visual, and it will help people understand, because maybe that’s the way it feels. The spirit is using the body more than it ever has when D.M.T. is in production—when its levels are high.

Me: Oh!

Erik: It’s like we can feel and use every crevice within our bodies a bit like a superman would—a superhuman.

Me: Hmm.

Erik: But it’s more in the realm of being super-spiritual.

Me: And I suppose all the things like meditation, good nutrition, exercise—do these things raise the D.M.T. level? Is this why those things work?

Erik: Well, that and endorphins. You can access D.M.T. more through deep meditation and the discipline of daily living. You know, you just can’t fuck around any more if you want that connection to the bigger picture. You really have to clean out your body and do it.

Me: Okay.

Erik: Our world is so corrupt and nasty and dirty that it’s not helping you naturally whereas back in the old frontier—

Jamie (laughing): He says that with a Texas twang.

Me: Let me whip out my banjo and accompany you, Erik.

Erik: No, but back then, it was easier, because you connected to the weather, the plants and the environment around you. You had a more peaceful lifestyle that was less stressful, and you had more meditative moments.

Me: And now life is more object-driven. Everybody wants stuff.

Erik: Yeah, it’s ego-driven.

Me: Yeah. Now, I know you’re going to cover this more during the event in Austin, but how can we learn to let go? That’s so hard for most of us, me included.

Jamie: He loves this question. He’s sitting down in the windowsill where I am. It’s pretty deep.

Erik: Letting go involves two things: One is the brain driven by the ego that keeps wanting to bring it up and look at it. Humans are naturally perfectionists, they want to over-analyze to understand what they could have done otherwise they feel that they have an incomplete answer.

Me: Okay.

Erik: So, sometimes letting go and you can’t means you don’t have all the information. But get this catch: Sometimes you can’t get all the info. You just can’t. That’s when you have to forgive and forget and say you’re just not meant to know. You’re totally on the right path, Mom. If you didn’t have your ego, then you wouldn’t have a hard time letting go, because it just wouldn’t be about you.

Me: Do we need our egos for anything? I feel like it’s an appendix like it’s a vestigial organ we don’t need anymore. Like wisdom teeth or something. Before we needed it for survival, but now they’re just a pain in the ass.

Jamie (laughing): He’s so laughing!

Me: Seriously, It doesn’t seem like we should have one at all!

Erik: No, you can see ego in a positive way. It helps us enjoy being individuals.

Me: Ah! Yeah, because I guess you don’t want to be completely connected with everything else all the time! I hear that spirits sometimes like to be by themselves and experience separation.

Erik: Yeah! Plus you need that separateness to have the contrast or duality for the human experience that makes the earthly plane such a great playing field for spiritual growth.

Me: Exactly! I see!

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