An Afterlife Interview with the African Slave Collective and Harriet Tubman

This subject is dear to my heart because I feel like this part of American history, along with our decimation of the Native Americans, is a horrible blight on our collective conscious. That’s why I petitioned (with little or no results) to replace Columbus Day (honoring a genocidal narcissist who didn’t even discover America) with Forgiveness Day, a day when we ask those we oppressed throughout history (and those in our current lives) for forgiveness.

I plan on having a separate session on the Civil Rights Movement and the current state of racism soon. But first, I want to poll you guys to see what kind of events you want hosts to hold at my home in the future. Remember that I have no financial ties to these events. I only try to lower ticket prices by offering my home to host them for free. I do care about offering what you’d benefit from most. Thanks in advance for taking this poll. It shouldn’t take more than 10 seconds and would mean a lot to me.

I feel very uncomfortable writing this, but I need to ask for your help. I just received a bill from my web company guys and it’s much more expensive than I thought. I know you guys probably think I’m wealthy, but I’m not. I sacrificed a 350-400K a year income as a physician to do what I do and spend a lot of money a month, not to mention the 14 hours a day of labor I spend with absolutely no pay. My husband makes a living, but much of that goes to bills and supporting some of our kids/grandkids. I’m considering returning to the practice of Medicine, particularly telemedicine, in an effort to help, but there are only so many hours in the day. So, particularly if you’ve yet to donate anything, if you get anything positive out of CE, please consider it. No amount is too small. You can click on the donate button on the righthand sidebar if you decide to donate. Please share on your timeline if you can. Thanks in advance. 

Also, thanks to some of you for sending me so many great ideas to help make the reality TV show happen! One example of an idea presented to me was to have a hook such as the psychic Uber driver who surprises his passengers with readings. In Paranormal Intervention, we could “crash” and help those in hospices, prisons, high schools, colleges, adolescent groups or halfway houses, and more. Privacy is an issue, but if you have any ideas, please, please, please email me at Thanks!

Big news: Jamin and Jennifer have decided to delay their event at least until September, and there will be changes in the program that will help a larger audience. More to come.

First, check out last night’s Hour of Enlightenment Radio Show! It’s about making mulah! You know you want it!! We all do! Thanks to Kim Voigt for channeling Erik wonderfully. Click HERE to find out more about her, and click HERE to get in touch with Allie O’Shea.

Enjoy the main event as channeled by medium, Michelle Gray. Check her out HERE.

Here’s the transcript. 

Elisa: Hello Michelle Gray and my boy Erik, how are you? Love you both! Michelle: We love you too.

Erik: Hi Mama.

Michelle: And he wants to right off the bat too. He says he wants me to share this and he wants all the viewers to hear this. He gave me the worst stink bomb I have ever smelled EVER. It was so bad that I was gagging. I had to open the car door, I had two other people with me and we’re all looking at each other and I knew exactly what was going on because Erik can be very distinct about the smell.

Elisa:  Oh yeah.

Michelle: And he’s laughing even right now. But he wants to let everybody know if you’re concerned that you’re not getting pranked because he says there’s some people that feel I don’t want to ask for a prank or I want to say anything because I Erik’s too busy or he might not come and see me and Erik’s like. No Way.

Erik:  You invite me to come and prank you. Keep your eyes, your ears and your smellers open.

Elisa: Oh boy.

Michelle:  So, he just wants everybody to hear that because he’s ready to play.

Elisa:  We need to keep them off the streets, man. Plus he was (inaudible) himself off infinitely. Okay, so.

Michelle:  Yes.

Elisa:   It’s no problem. I wish I could do that.

Michelle:  No kidding.

Elisa:  I would get a lot more done today. Oh Man.

Michelle:  No kidding.

Elisa:  Yeah. Okay. So before people like in case they drop off toward the end, you know, I want to remind you guys that you can get in touch with Michelle and I’ll repeat this at the end at the healing h, ash a r Okay. No wait, is that it?

Michelle: Yeah,

Elisa:  Yeah.

Michelle:  That’s right.

Elisa:  Yep. And y’all please, we want to get this reality TV show going so we need bigger social media presence. So please follow me on Instagram and I have that all that on the blog and stuff. Instagram, Twitter, subscribe to the YouTube   Channel, like the channeling Erik Facebook page and we’ll, we’re good to go. Alright, so guess what? We are going to talk about the African slave. You’re going to interview, channel, the African slave collective. So can you bring in some former African slaves and perhaps Harriet Tubman too or whoever else you think would be great. They’re all great.

Michelle: Erik actually already has someone here. He’s had a woman here, for the last about 10 minutes or so. She’s saying that she’s the mother, she’s calling herself the mother or a mother energy.

Elisa:  Okay.

Michelle:  I asked her what, what can we call you? And she says you can call me Mary.

Elisa:  Okay.

Michelle: Use the name Mary.

Elisa:   Is that her African name?. What’s your African name or were you an African slave?

Mary:  Yes, yes. I was an African slave.

Michelle: I can’t quite get the pronunciation of it. Mary: It would translate to be Mary.

Elisa:  Oh, okay!

Michelle:  We would call her Mary. So she’s saying that it’s like an American name.

Elisa: Okay.

Michelle: So she was appointed that name, so that wasn’t her original name. She was appointed that name. I’ll just tell you what she’s wearing because it’s quite interesting. It’s very gauzy material. It looks like medical gauze, like that type of fabric and it’s a bit of a off white color, slightly an oatmeal color and very light. It’s very light feeling and so she is here. She’s also, just saying that she’s representing, the collective, representing the, she’s calling it the different eras.

Elisa: Ah!

Michelle: Of slavery.

Elisa: Okay, good. Can Harriet Tubman also come in if we need her? Oh yeah, we have questions for her.

Michelle: Is Harriet a tall lady?

Elisa: I have no idea. Erik, did you bring her in?

Michelle: Yeah, I’m getting a tall lady. There’s a lady here, as you’ve asked for Harriet, there’s a tall lady here. Kind of a big presence to her that she was a big woman, but a big presence.Like somebody that spoke or somebody that spoke up, somebody that I’m a leader of some sort.

Elisa: Okay, good. Well, we’ll talk to her. All right, so For anybody, what was life like in Africa before slavery?

Michelle: So Mary’s just showing me, first of all, fields cultivating, there were different types of crop that were being cultivated. She says that there was, hierarchies of families. So  there were areas in Africa that would have families that were slightly more wealthy than others. So there was always, say, a family that may have what would be considered a slave, even if it wasn’t always that it was treated that way, but it wasn’t uncommon for families to pay for somebody to have help. She’s also saying that there was, an abundance of crop, an abundance of land and she’s talking about it being, like they would refer to it as the glory days, as the good days, as the glory days, as the days that were thought about, when a lot of them were taken from Africa and she emphasizes, taken.

Elisa: Yeah. So the, the slaves that the wealthier Africans paid money for, how was it determined that somebody particular would be, taken in as a slave?

Mary: It had to do with wealth, family distinction.

Elisa: What would a father or mother sell their daughter, for example, or.

Mary: Yes, that, that did happen. Not always. It wasn’t always a rule so to speak. Sometimes it was for money, sometimes it was to gain something, to gain arms.

Michelle: So there must’ve been guns like things that were not easily, obtained by some of the stature of the type of money that they made or based on their wealth.

Elisa: What about.

Mary: There was also some, families that might have been involved in, like robbery or something. So they would treat that entire family like they were bad. They would be labeled so that they would give up the women so that they wouldn’t be hurt or they wouldn’t be cast aside and they would go and spread them amongst these families. There were different circumstances.

Elisa:  Okay.

Michelle: Of why it would happen?

Elisa:  Well, would they also, sell person within the family or maybe the tribe would sell a person in the family, to gain more land or domesticated animals like cattle or anything like that?

Mary: That did happen as well. Although the experience was not pleasant for all of them for some it was something that was expected. So whether it was regenerational in their family, but it was just like the way it was for them. So they didn’t see it as horrible. Although there were conditions for some that did experience things that weren’t overly pleasant.

Michelle: What the comparison she’s showing me what they look back on afterwards looking back at that time as being so much easier for them.

Elisa: Yeah.

Mary: People, had their own ways of trading from one side of Africa to the other.

Michelle: Like there must have been like, cause she’s showing me a line. So there was like a king on the side and a king on this side type of like as an example. And that they would trade or they would trade back and forth for certain things for that area of the land.

Elisa: Were they ever take it by force? Slaves in Africa by other Africans.?

Mary: There were circumstances that that did happen.

Elisa: Like maybe between two warring tribes and then they took all the losers, the ones who lost as slaves?

Mary: Yes, yes, they became, the reason why they in some of those circumstances would not be treated well is because they were considered the enemy. They were considered part of, like part of the ones that are against them is how they would look at it.

Michelle: She’s just, she’s pointing out, like she really puts an emphasis on taken. I feel that she was taken from her family, that she was ripped away from her family.

Elisa: By Africans or (inaudible).

Mary: It was actually by Africans.

Elisa: Okay.

Mary: But it was to be taken across to the Americas.

Elisa:  Oh my gosh. All right, so how did it first happen over there in Africa? Slavery that is.

Mary:  Through trade, through obtaining from different areas, not only through Africa, but also she’s saying across.

Michelle: I don’t know my geography very well, but she’s saying across like Europe.

Elisa:  Okay.

Mary:  So there’s trading and so that became something that they just did.

Elisa:  Okay.

Mary:  And that is also, how it led to be going overseas or going across. It all had to do with, the route of getting more, getting more and taking somebody else’s personal freedom away because of a family they were born into or the circumstances that they had found themselves in.. Some by choice, some would want to leave the families or leave the areas that they are in. So some would volunteer to go to another family.

Elisa:  Okay.

Mary: But when they went across on the boats.

Elisa:  Yeah, I mean when the white people, British Americans, whatever, took the people, ripped them from the tribes. Oh, first of all, what was the matriarchal or patriarchal, thing going on with the tribes in Africa at that time?

Mary: Patriarchal.

Elisa:  Okay. Tell me about the horrible voyage I’ve seen (inaudible). Tell me about the voyage wasn’t just one ship, obviously, but the, in general, what the voyage was like for these poor, shackled human beings.

Michelle: Oh it was just horrible. I’ll just share with you what she’s showing me.

Elisa:  Oh God.

Michelle:  She’s showing me a little children, there is people out in fields and they’re working, she’s calling it an ambush that they were ambushed and that this is something that happens.  It was also happening from some of the European countries as well.

Mary:  We were being ambushed and we would hear about it from different areas. We would hear that it was ambushed, that people were taken.

Michelle:  And she showing me fire. She’s showing me screaming, running, like it’s something from a horrible movie. Like it doesn’t even, you can’t even imagine or want to believe that actually happened to people. It’s just horrible and there are babies and there’s no real concern.

Mary: There was no respect for any humanness. There was no compassion.

Elisa:  They were treated like cattle and they’re just like us. They’re just, they’re not even human. They probably just looked at them as property, animals. What can you tell me, about the, now let’s shift to the ships, transporting them to Europe, the Americas, etc. What was it?

Michelle:  Oh, oh, okay. So…

Michelle starts crying.

Elisa: Poor Michelle! Oh God.

Michelle:  It’s pretty gross, it’s really smelly. Uh, the ships were, they were big, but they needed to be bigger for the capacity of people. They put a lot of people on the ships. She’s talking about them being sandwiched in, in the bottom. So like underneath. They were sandwiched in.

Mary:  There was a lot of fighting, there were rodents on the ship, there were diseases.

Elisa:  Were there many women and children? Were women and children also transported?

Mary:  There were some children, but there was no care, to a child being separated from its mother. There was no, no real, concern for that, because this did happen and it wasn’t always by the same people, there was groups of them doing this and it was the Africans that were receiving money, in the way of, arms like, certain types of guns or things that they would not be able to obtain. You mean the government and tribes or both? From America, from like selling them.

Elisa:  To who did they sell it to? The African government or African tribes or both?

Mary:   Yes, it would go, yes, it would go to the government.

Michelle:   She’s showing me that there were separate tribes that kind of went at each other and also there was some fighting that went outside of Africa as well. So it was obtaining weapons that weren’t readily available. Okay. She’s just going to take me back to the ship for a moment. So she said that there was a lot of, she’s addressing this smell and saying that they’re, you know, there was no facilities for anyone. So the amount of people, and of course they’re all, some of them are getting sick on the ship.

Elisa:  Yeah.

Mary:  Throwing up. They are not able to use a washroom or anything. They were being thrown off the ship.

Elisa:  Why?

Mary:  Because we were sick, because of spreading more disease.

Elisa:  So, someone with disease, they would toss him over?

Mary:  If they felt that they were contaminating others. That it was easier to toss over.

Elisa:  Even children?

Mary:  Yes.

Elisa:  Okay, go on.

Mary:  Yes. They felt that if there was one that was going to contaminate that it was better to lose that one or two than to lose 30 of them because they didn’t have proper, like there wasn’t any medical care or anything else like that. There was a good percentage that never made it ,

Elisa:  Yeah. What percentage died or just didn’t make it? I mean, on average.

Mary:  Around 20%.

Elisa:   Wow. How many pf you were in the ships? I’m sure it depends, obviously the bigger ships and smaller ships, but the bigger ships, how many did they hold?

Michelle:  She’s giving me 33. I’m thinking 3,300.

Elisa:  Per ship. Can you clarify that, Erik? Can you clarify it? Was it 330, maybe 3,300, 33?

Michelle:  Yeah, what did you say first? 330. But there were, there were a lot that were transported in total.

Elisa:  Oh yeah I’m sure she’s doing it like over and over and over and over and over. She’s doing with her hands. Like there was boat after boat after boat.

Michelle:  Pardon me?

Elisa:  About how long was the trip on the average week.

Mary:  Several weeks.

Elisa:  Okay.

Mary:  When we made it to land that there were some, they had them sold off. They were doing things to mark them to who had, who belonged to who.

Elisa:  Oh God.

Mary:  Like cutting them, like slashing them, so like to mark their arms.

Michelle:   What is that Erik, a brand?

Elisa:  Oh, Jesus. (inaudible) that voyage, they had to feed them otherwise they would all die. What did they get to eat?

Michelle:  It’s like a grain.

Erik:  Like a wheat or some sort of grain, it looks similar to corn.

Elisa: Oh my God. They’re just feeding them like pigs and cows.

Michelle:  Yeah. Yeah. Well and truthfully, Mary is just saying that that’s absolutely how they treated them. They were like, they were stock. They were livestock. That’s basically how they were in their minds. They said when they got onto land they were happy to be off the boat. But what was happening.

Mary:  The branding was to designate where they were going or who belonged to who.

Erik:  They were being met or they were being waited on, so they, they were expecting to be able to have a group of slaves per wherever that they were going.

Michelle:   And it feels like they’re being spread across America.

Elisa:  So they’d go to different ports.

Michelle:  It would go to different ports. It feels like they all went into one.

Elisa: And then fanned out from there.

Michelle:  But it’s still, it does feel like a certain amount stayed in one area. That that grew in that area?

Elisa:  Where was that? I mean, what a general location in the U.S, obviously must be on the east coast, right?

Michelle:  Virginia.

Elisa:  Okay. All right, probably Jamestown. I don’t know, but we don’t have to know that.

Michelle: It’s outside, it’s moving up from there though.

Elisa:  Okay.

Michelle:  Just up a little bit, again, I don’t really know my geography.

Elisa:  So I understand that the very first person to buy a slave was actually an African American. Is that really true? And why did he do that?

Michelle:  Well, so an African American that what you’re saying, an African American that was in the U.S or somewhere in the Americas, I don’t know exactly could have been in the West indies. I don’t know, but keep talking.

Erik: That that is true but he wasn’t the only one he’s talking about there were some wealthy families that took them in and treated them as family members even though they were still serving. Like they still were help but that they were considered more like family. There are stories.

Michelle: Oh, that’s interesting.

Mary:  Stories is what was left as to be able to document what happened. That it was generational stories.

Michelle: She just added that.

Elisa:  The first (inaudible) America was not only a black man, he went to court and demanded it. 1654, I don’t know. It was time for Anthony to release, John Cassar, a black indentured servant. Instead, Anthony told Cassar he was extending his time anyway, so it went to court, suits and stuff like that. But, anyway, so Anthony Johnson was the first apparently.

Erik:  There was, one of the first one, that’s exactly right, one of the first because that did, there were some that had lives that were not like some of the other ones got.

Michelle: I guess that there were some that were off the boat or just off the boat that we’re so unhappy that they would kill themselves, that they would commit suicide. I just asked, because they’re showing me them shuffling. I just asked it like, they must be shackled like did any try to run or like, I guess that’s the feeling I would have that I would just want to run.

Erik:  They would have been shot and they knew that and there were some that wanted to be shot that would take that because in their mind and it was being dead was going back to the promise land.

Elisa:  Oh yeah. So can you tell us a little bit about the life of a slave in general? I’m sure that like you said, the were probably the slaves that were treated almost like family, but they had to do stuff more. But, I don’t know how common was that?

Michelle:  Harriet’s stepping forward here.

Elisa:  Okay.

Harriet:  You want to know what a typical life for slave was?

Elisa:  Yeah.

Harriet:  Depending on what your gender was, because there were male and female slaves.

Elisa: Yeah.

Harriet:  Depending on what your gender was, would depend on what your roles would be.

Elisa:  Age too probably, right?

Harriet:  And age, yes, yes, because even the children were slaves. The children also had responsibilities when they were very young. They would be with the parent or sometimes they’d be with older relatives that would help care for them. That wouldn’t be doing the same work as some of the younger ones would. So mornings would start very early, a lot of the women would do work. They would have gardening, they would have food and some would be with crop. They also would have chickens. They would have some that would be part of the home, people that worked in, the home did not  mix with people that worked in with the animals or with the food that they were, you have different areas that we were segregated to. The help that was in the house was the favorited help. It was, you were doing well if you were right with your master, if you were serving them and working in that area, you were treated well. You were given the respect, even though we would never look at it as that, there was a certain level of respect that they had, but that was as long as they did what they were told to do and as long as didn’t step out of any lines or bounds because those boundaries would be made very stiff. And it was also, when people would come to visit.

Michelle:  She’s just showing me how important it was that they would show how well behaved their staff was, how well behaved they had their staff in line.

Elisa:  Where did they sleep? Both inside in house and also the ones that did the crops, livestock, all that stuff.

Harriet:  They didn’t sleep in the main quarters. They never slept in the main house on that wouldn’t have been tolerated. But there were occasions and there were some families that had somebody that was ill in the home and so there would be circumstances where they may have one that stays in the home for the purpose of a boiling at night or for doing things to care or to receive a doctor or something of that nature. A lot of times the, house help when they would make their calls for the night and it would be done in staggers that it wouldn’t all be done at the same time. They would return to their areas, but a lot of the people that were in with the animals, and doing that work, they lived on a different side of the property even though the slave orders would be in designated areas that some masters would have designated sleeping areas as well.

Elisa: (inaudible) right for the crop workers as well?

Harriet:  Yes. Yes, yes. Mainly cotton.

Elisa:  Okay. What was the beds, the sleeping, things like that where did they lay their head down? Did they have pillows and comforters? No.

Michelle:  No, a lot of them, they have some blankets. They would have some, they’re showing me like what looks like horse blankets, they look like big blankets that you might see in a barn? They’re not colorful or anything. They look like they’re kind of a deep reddish brown than they all kind of look the same, they did have beds and some of them were iron beds and they were just small. They look like a cot size. A lot of them slept on the floor.

Elisa:  No mattresses in the iron beds.

Michelle: They’re showing me like the blankets stacked up.

Elisa: Okay. Okay.

Michelle:  So it would make like a, it would soften it somewhat, but they didn’t actually have mattresses like we would like, we would understand.

Elisa:  What were they fed as a general rule?

Michelle: There’s like a porridge that Harriet’s showing me. It looks like something that was available to them fairly easy. They also could make some other things, dependent on Harriet’s. Is it depending on where you were located, the family that you were with? Some were, you’d be lucky if you got scraps. There were men that would go out and they would go with the master and they would shoot or kill and say something couldn’t have been found that was shot, that they would go back and they would find it at night and then they would take it back and cook it and eat it.

Elisa:  Would they be allowed to like raise chickens for eggs and meat or things like that?

Harriet:  Some were, some were.

Elisa:  All right.

Mary:  In the very beginning of when a lot of this started to take place across America, it was, it’s not that they all were like this, but, the conditions seemed to lighten a little bit over time.

Elisa:  Okay.

Mary:  In some ways, although I’m not near in anyway, that you would consider lightened.

Elisa: So, were they given close when they needed it or did they even come in with clothes or were they completely naked on the ships? And then again?

Michelle:  Some were pretty close. Some were pretty close. And you can see a lot of torn clothing. Not very good condition and clothing. A lot of them did have clothing, the better dressed your servants were or the better dressed your help was, the better the master looked, better their plantation or their location seem to look.

Elisa: The status.

Mary: It wasn’t, it was a status symbol. Clothing was a status symbol. We may not have had the best clothing and again, it depended on where they were. The ones that worked in the house would have nicer looking, clothes and would have access to, leftovers.

Elisa:  Well, when they had, did they have their own little family life on a plantation and then tell me what they did in their off hours. I know that that’s where the roots of the blues were (inaudible) and just the communal aspects, amongst…

Michelle:  She’s got a really big, big smile. And she’s just like, she’s got really long fingers too.

Elisa:  Oh, wow.

Michelle:  And, and she’s kind of tapping her leg, like she’s just getting to the beat and she says that they had, a banjo. Was it like little wooden banjo? She’s showing me there’s music, there’s like Kazoo type sounds.

Mary:  We had rituals, like they had spiritual rituals that we did. We gathered as families in different cabins or we had meeting areas and we had their own, and again.

Harriet: In different plantations or different places they may have had, not as tight a rules. They were allowed to have a little bit of a life of their own as long as it was of their own and they didn’t disturb anything with the family.

Elisa:  Were they able to protect their children, the children in the community and their little communal circle?

Michelle:  Where they able to protect them?

Elisa: Protect them and raise them, let them be children I don’t know.

Harriet:  As best as best as we could. Children always had imaginations and they didn’t know any different. This is what they were born into.

Elisa:  Well at least the ones that we’re born into, but the ones that were taken right off the ship, that must have been horrible.

Harriet:  Yeah, it was, there was a lot of trauma.

Michelle:  She had what she was showing me when she said they were coming across the ship, she’d just show me flashes of them being waking up, screaming and sweating because they’d go back to that moment.

Elisa:  Did they get medical care? I mean a dead slave is worthless slave. Those idiots probably thought.

Harriet:  Yeah, basic, basic medical care usually when something was really wrong, if, if it could be handled. Yes.

Elisa:  All right. What about the children or the plantation owners? Were they allowed to play with the African children, slave children? What did the parents of the white children over, what were they told about the whole thing?

Harriet:  Usually not as a rule. The, children were strictly told that they were not as smart as them. They were told to stay away from them. That they could have diseases that they are not intelligent, like treating them like they were some sort of a part wild animal.

Elisa:  Jesus.

Harriet:  So some of the children would have a bit of fear of them because they just knew it was, their parents thought it was bad. There was a lot of a lot of fear.

Elisa:  I bet there was some on occasion that befriended little kids befriended each.

Harriet: Oh yeah and fell in love and ran away.

Elisa:  Yeah. Let’s, let’s talk about, oh wow. Let’s talk about that. How often were the female slaves raped or sexually assaulted by the white people.?

Harriet:  Unfortunately it was common.

Elisa:  And they probably had biracial kids. When they did give birth, did they let that kid live or what happened?

Harriet:  A lot of times they would hide the children. They would keep them out of the limelight so they weren’t paid attention to. There were also times depending on the color of the child. So if the child came out looking too dark, then that child would stay with the mother, if the child came out looking white, then it was assumed that the master of the family would take the child and take it as their own.

Michelle:  And that’s not because of, it’s not because of anything, they’re trying to help. It has something to do with that they felt like that child was white. So that was their child.

Elisa:  Yeah, (inaudible) not want their neighbors to know what’s going on oh.

Michelle:  Right, right, right. It’s all very, she’s calling it all very twisted reasons.

Elisa:  Oh God. Okay. So what about, I’m sure that sometimes the white people on the plantation would fall in love with an African, a slave woman or vice versa?

Michelle: Yes. That’s what she just said. And vice versa, that, did happen.

Erik:  There are many agreements, many soul agreements.

Elisa:  I was wondering about.

Erik:  That came into play.

Elisa:  I could see, well that slave woman, she’s in my soul family. She’s my twin flame. I mean, subconsciously, whatever.

Erik:  That was, sometimes very heartbreaking with lethal results, whereas, someone would be killed because of it. There were stories that they were able to run away and they were able to have a family and continue on in a life at a time where it was very hard to be biracial.

Elisa:  That must’ve been so hard. All right. So do you think Harriet this is for you, do you think that African Americans would have been better off today if their ancestors were never taken as slaves? And so they grew up in generation after generation in Africa? I mean, say Joe Johnson, you know, in whatever town. Do you think he would’ve been better off if his ancestors were never taken a slaves?

Harriet:  It’s a bit of a hard question to answer because there are many components to, depending on how you look at it, when you look at the big picture and you look at the fact that this all happened, for ways that we as human beings cannot fathom or even understand that there would be spiritual because there would be agreements. There would be a bigger picture to evolution to why this happened. But there’s also a component of humanity. Where consciousness was and the reason why all of these things are important is to remember that we came together and it doesn’t make it right how we came together. But the fact is, is there’s something very powerful, very powerful in the lessons that we have as an opportunity to look at. And that each individual whose ancestors, what they went through, what they have to look at. So, does that make it more beneficial for someone today? Well, it can, but it all depends on the perspective of that individual.

Elisa:  That’s true. So do you think that everyone who became slaves signed up for, was it all spiritual contracts?

Harriet:  Yes.

Erik:  A lot of them were group soul contracts. Just like how we would look at a group like the titanic, how that was like a group contract to go down in the Titanic, there was a group contract.

Elisa:  Don’t sign me up for that one. Oh God.

Michelle:  No.

Erik:  You know, we’ve all experienced, we’ve all, you know, depending on what, what we are and what race we are in this lifetime, we’ve all been, every race, we’ve all experienced everything, you know, and it’s hard to fathom a human mind around that, especially when we know of something that was so painful and just so inhumane in every way.

Elisa:  So what was the big picture purpose for slavery in America or in Europe? Of course he would volunteer their soul to go through that and what was the purpose of the slave experience for black people? I know here is a person saying, I know it was asked before in regards to the purpose for humans, Well, yeah. What’s the purpose of all this?

Harriet:  Well, it is freedom is freedom, but not just freedom in one way, but in many different ways.

Erik:  It’s personal freedom, it’s equality. If you look at where evolution has come from, that at every stage of when we’ve gone through a major shift, there have been pioneers that have had to stand out from a big group and fight for something that’s not right. And it ends up at the end of the day to pointing to we’re all as one and we’re all unique with freedom.

Elisa:  Yeah.

Erik:  And we all have freedom of choice.

Elisa:  Yeah, it’s polarity. We learned from contrast.

Michelle:  Yes.

Elisa:  What better way to learn the value of freedom and us being a collective of us being one than to have this slavery experience happen, unfortunately.

Michelle:  Yes.

Elisa:  Like Adolph Hitler had a spiritual contract apparently to usher in, you know, decades of peace after that, Holocaust. Anyway, so I’ve got a couple more questions. How many souls who died as slaves chose to return to another life, to help the family bloodlines, heal from and grow compassionately from this history? Was that very common?

Erik:  Yes. Yes., they wanted to, that this was an agreement that had generations to it.

Elisa:  Ah.

Erik:  This is still playing out in some karmic release within some family bloodlines. So this is still coming up in some ways, within some families.

Elisa:   Okay. Mary or Harriet or both, do you have any advice right now for African Americans living in America or anywhere in the world today that might help them?

Michelle:  The first thing that they both said was they both stood shoulder to shoulder and said to continue to stand proud. We continue to stand tall and to continue to stand for what you believe in and don’t let anybody tell you and Harriet just says, and this goes for all of you. Don’t let anyone ever tell you that something is not possible for you because of who you are, what you look like, the color, your skin, who you know, what you don’t know, don’t let anyone else tell you, you do exactly what you want to do and be proud  of who you are and be proud of where you’ve come from.

Elisa:  Well said. And I think that the more we concentrate on, oh, this is this racist, this racist, then the more divided. I just can’t wait until we all interbreed so much and we’re all the same fricking color. My first boyfriend actually was, was black George Taylor. Oh God such a sweet, Hi George, if you’re out there. My husband’s going to hate me for this! A sweet Engineering student at Rice University where I went. So such a gentleman, I just really don’t know what happened to us, but okay. Do you have any advice for Africa itself? For the Africans in Africa and including the decertification that’s going on? It’s just awful.

Harriet:  I’m sending love, love to their collective, love to their governments. There’s some separation that’s occurring or some feel of separation.

Michelle:  And she’s talking about communication, to promote communication on all fronts.

Elisa:  Okay. Well what should they do about the fact that the everything’s turning into desert, I mean they’ve got so little, I mean less and less arable land, where they can grow crops.

Harriet:  There are some very smart people, there’s some very smart people that are paying attention to what is happening.

Michelle:  But she’s talking about people communicating and being informed. There like, just asking is there like some solution or something?

Erik:  This is something that’s not happening like it’s not something that’s happening right now. Like it’s not something that’s going to be in this lifetime.

Elisa:  Okay. All right. Well hopefully there is a solution because that can bring about so much poverty, last but not least here’s something from, it’s a kind of a long paragraph from a blog member. I do not. I do know that there were Africans who had ventured from Africa and settled in the South East area of America way before slaves were brought over. I would love to know from what countries in the African they sailed from, I don’t, I don’t want to take the time to that because we’re out of it. If any of them were able to stay out of the hands of slave traders and slave owners who eventually settled in the Americas. Also, well let’s start with that first. Also, how did the aboriginal people of America received them? Like the native Americans?

Michelle:  Okay, so the first part, can you just read that first question.

Elisa:  Yeah. Were they able to stay out of the hands of the slave traders?

Michelle:  Yeah. Okay. So that is true. That is true. There are some, so they’re just showing me,.

Erik:  When we were talking a little bit earlier, but when they went, some of them that were in Africa were traded

Elisa:  Yeah I remember that.

Erik:  And that some of them went to families, so there were other ways that they were able to come over and, no, they didn’t all come over as slaves.

Elisa:  Oh.

Erik:  And there were some that came from so that because they went across Europe across that way. I don’t know. How did the native Americans, you know, received them, native Americans? That there was a lot of sickness and death at that time.

Elisa:  The Native Americans?

Michelle:  That there was the native Americans, there was something that was going on with them at that time. With an illness or something because it doesn’t feel like it’s intersecting.

Elisa:   Okay.

Michelle:  It doesn’t feel like something that’s intersecting or something that like, I don’t know if they didn’t have an awareness of each other all at that , you know what I mean? Like it didn’t happen. You (inaudible)that way.

Elisa:  Because of this illness may be TB. I don’t know, amongst Native Americans I really kind of never really encountered or really.

Michelle:   It feels like, because there was some.

Erik:  The population had decreased.

Elisa:  Oh, I see. Yeah.

Michelle:  So they weren’t, it didn’t all happen integrate all the way that we might have thought.

Elisa:  But when they did meet. What did they, what did the native Americans, how do they, how do they treat the, the Africans who came over as frequently?

Harriet:  There was some fear. There was some fear because they were different.

Elisa:  On both sides?

Harriet:  Yes. Yes, and there was also,, because there were stories, stories that they had. So their cultures had stories about what they were. When the Africans came across, they thought that the white people were cannibals. They didn’t know that they are going as slaves. They thought they were eating them.

Elisa:  Oh my God.

Harriet:  Because they just kept bringing them.

Elisa:  Would have been better off?

Michelle:  Yeah. Oh my gosh.

Elisa:  He goes on. So these people live as free people of color in the south for a long time. There’s now a black tribe recognized by, I believe in West Virginia and will not, they will not allow any more people into the tribe because they’re trying to prove to the U.S that they have been here in America before African slaves arrived and they are pure, real native, a pure and real native American tribe. I don’t know. Do you have anything to say about that? So free people of Color in the south, a black tribe. That’s cool. So is that true?

Erik:   It is true.

Michelle: He’s talking about them coming across like this is all from integration that had come across from Africa and over and had integrated. I don’t know if they didn’t come through Eric, did they not come through the U.S Or through a different area of the U.S. But they weren’t aware of each other, like they were living in their area way over here and like Erik showing me a big separation. It’s not like there was any.

Elisa:  Okay.

Michelle:  Intersecting going on.

Erik:  There is truth to that. Yes.

Elisa:  Okay. Awesome. Thank you so much Mary. Thank you Harriet. Thank you Michelle. Thank you Erik. I think we’re going to have to do a whole other thing on Harriet Tubman, Rosa Parks, civil rights, it just this whole thing because I think it’s so important. Yeah, so you guys check out Michelle at I’m getting good at this !

Michelle:   You are!

Elisa:  And I’ll put it right here and before you go take a pee stop, please go follow me on Instagram, Twitter, like the CE, the Channelling Erik Facebook page, and please click subscribe. It would really help. I love you all.

Erik:  Love you, Mom. Love you, everybody.

Elisa:  Love you.

Michelle:  Bye

Elisa:  Bye. Bye.

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Elisa Medhus